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Dan Balash

2013 ISU Classifications

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Class 1A:

Eureka

Olympia

Herscher

U-High

Illinois Valley Central

Marengo

 

Class 2A:

Morton

Limestone

Providence Catholic

Lincoln-Way West

Lakes Community

 

Class 3A:

Marian Catholic

Bloomington

Lemont

Normal West

Argo Community

 

Class 4A:

United Township

Romeoville

Lincoln-Way North

Quincy

T.F. South

Lincoln-Way Central

 

Class 5A:

John Hersey

Plainfield North

Prospect

Victor J. Andrew

Wheaton North

Lincoln-Way East

Wheaton Warrenville South

Edwardsville

 

Class 6A:

Lake Park

Naperville Central

Downers Grove South

Naperville North

Lockport Township

Warren Township

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

Class 1A:

Eureka

Olympia

Herscher

U-High

Illinois Valley Central

Marengo

 

Class 2A:

Morton

Limestone

Providence Catholic

Lincoln-Way West

Lakes Community

 

Class 3A:

Marian Catholic

Bloomington

Lemont

Normal West

Argo Community

 

Class 4A:

United Township

Romeoville

Lincoln-Way North

Quincy

T.F. South

Lincoln-Way Central

 

Class 5A:

John Hersey

Plainfield North

Prospect

Victor J. Andrew

Wheaton North

Lincoln-Way East

Wheaton Warrenville South

Edwardsville

 

Class 6A:

Lake Park

Naperville Central

Downers Grove South

Naperville North

Lockport Township

Warren Township

 

If this was in it's normal spot at the end of October I could see there being a lot more groups and 5A/6A would have made a few groups very upset they didn't make the cut. Though I still hope that this will be the year they do two things:

 

1) No more of this seven from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A. Make it like everywhere else that has finals or state circuits. Top 14 of the day exhibition from class champion if they don't make it. This way it makes finals actually definitively final.

 

2) I have said it numerous times. Judge panel for All of Prelims and a panel Just for Finals. Enough said.

 

Additionally this actually can improve groups. Want to know why? It is a goal that pushes you a lot more and it actually becomes a sophisticated and passionate goal. You want to make finals then everyone should be your competition not just a set number. Now honestly I don't think that way I think your only competition should be you and only you but to be frank most groups probably wish to have that mentality. Though I then say who is stopping you.

 

 

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I'm a little confused about this. Do we have the enrollment divisions for each class?

 

The way I understand it is this: Two bands made the request to move up a class, a request that was accommodated.  The next largest school size was moved down in each case to do this.

 

 

If this was in it's normal spot at the end of October I could see there being a lot more groups and 5A/6A would have made a few groups very upset they didn't make the cut. Though I still hope that this will be the year they do two things:

 

1) No more of this seven from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A. Make it like everywhere else that has finals or state circuits. Top 14 of the day exhibition from class champion if they don't make it. This way it makes finals actually definitively final.

 

2) I have said it numerous times. Judge panel for All of Prelims and a panel Just for Finals. Enough said.

 

Additionally this actually can improve groups. Want to know why? It is a goal that pushes you a lot more and it actually becomes a sophisticated and passionate goal. You want to make finals then everyone should be your competition not just a set number. Now honestly I don't think that way I think your only competition should be you and only you but to be frank most groups probably wish to have that mentality. Though I then say who is stopping you.

 

Another way to look at it is, finals is the same "top ten" as it was before - routinely 3 from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A - plus four additional bands from 1A-4A including "class champions".

This has actually improved groups in 1A-4A, because of the increased focus on them to perform and compete for "their seven" finals positions.

not that different than any IHSA class championships. 

 

 

Another thing that you have to keep in mind:  Other than the aberrant weather we had a few years back (2008, I think), you have to remember this is October in Illinois.  ISU is generally cold/rainy/windy, and that coupled with the fact that we're outside doesn't generally make a "14 bands plus exhibition" feasible, because the show would carry on and on-not to mention if the show gets delayed like it did in 2011.

 

ISU could conceivably either take the show down to 35-40 bands maximum to have a "14 plus exhibition", or have some performances on Friday, but neither will happen.

 

Since the show was adjusted to be 14 band finals in 2010, here's what would have happened had the show gone with exhibition bands and top 14 overall:

2010: Romeoville takes seed #13, Warren out of Finals, Eureka in exhibition.

2011: 4 new bands in: Naperville Central, Wheaton Warrenville South, Glenbrook South, Belleville East.  Morton and IVC in exhibition, LWC and Normal West out of finals.

2012: Lemont and Herscher in exhibition, Glenbrook South and John Hersey make finals.

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

 

Another way to look at it is, finals is the same "top ten" as it was before - routinely 3 from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A - plus four additional bands from 1A-4A including "class champions".

This has actually improved groups in 1A-4A, because of the increased focus on them to perform and compete for "their seven" finals positions.

not that different than any IHSA class championships. 

 

Another thing that you have to keep in mind:  Other than the aberrant weather we had a few years back (2008, I think), you have to remember this is October in Illinois.  ISU is generally cold/rainy/windy, and that coupled with the fact that we're outside doesn't generally make a "14 bands plus exhibition" feasible, because the show would carry on and on-not to mention if the show gets delayed like it did in 2011.

 

ISU could conceivably either take the show down to 35-40 bands maximum to have a "14 plus exhibition", or have some performances on Friday, but neither will happen.

 

Since the show was adjusted to be 14 band finals in 2010, here's what would have happened had the show gone with exhibition bands and top 14 overall:

2010: Romeoville takes seed #13, Warren out of Finals, Eureka in exhibition.

2011: 4 new bands in: Naperville Central, Wheaton Warrenville South, Glenbrook South, Belleville East.  Morton and IVC in exhibition, LWC and Normal West out of finals.

2012: Lemont and Herscher in exhibition, Glenbrook South and John Hersey make finals.

 

Not Lemont in 2012. In any case every year besides 2011 would have only 1 band in exhibition which I think is not that much of a problem. Starting finals ten minutes earlier still isn't crazy amount of extra time. Now with the weather I can understand that would be a problem and would screw things up and especially all those potential delays, which was 2010 by the way, that would ruin things pretty poorly. However, I still stand to say that only competing for one of seven finals spots to me is a very safe and I absolutely hate how IHSA works so that ruins and potential connection I would want. Additionally I do hope that we get the judging panels fixed though. I still believe that is a much larger priority then fixing the 14 in finals since that will probably fix it a bit more.

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PN moving to 5A = a 2-band swing of finals-calibre bands (-1 from the 1-4A group and +1 to the 5-6A group). Sorry, but the number of bands in 5-6A needs to be increased. I never liked the 7/7 mix, and now I like it even less.

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PN moving to 5A = a 2-band swing of finals-calibre bands (-1 from the 1-4A group and +1 to the 5-6A group). Sorry, but the number of bands in 5-6A needs to be increased. I never liked the 7/7 mix, and now I like it even less.

 

Now for this situation having 14 finalists from any class would work here. However, the 5A-6A bands are now ultra competitive more so than 1A-4A ever is (still two different judging panels will screw that up). So this is an excellent reason to do that and to be frank the finalists we would want to see are going to be in finals because they will make it happen and the ones that make it every so often will have to show us that they are ahead of the game  and are supposed to be in that position. As much as I want to say it is really only a competition against yourself, in this case it is very hard to think that way.

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The 7/7 is not going to change, for the time being.  ISU hosted directors at the Midwest convention in 2009 to discuss restructuring the event, and the directors that attended agreed to the judging changes as well as the finals format, as a much needed change from the old format, where the judges judged ALL of prelims in their captions, then switched captions for finals and did it again.

 

It's probably a good assumption that if a number of directors wanted a format change, ISU would probably make said change if possible.

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

 

It's probably a good assumption that if a number of directors wanted a format change, ISU would probably make said change if possible.

 

Oh I hope so. And I really wonder now who was at that meeting at Midwest. Additionally why would they not come to the aggreement of two different panels with completely different people for prelims and finals. They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

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It's probably a good assumption that if a number of directors wanted a format change, ISU would probably make said change if possible.

 

Oh I hope so. And I really wonder now who was at that meeting at Midwest. Additionally why would they not come to the aggreement of two different panels with completely different people for prelims and finals. They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

 

I think if you would want a better idea of illinois top 14 you would need:

  • Every band in every class competes for a finalist spot
  • Class winners aren't guaranteed a finalist spot

 

Also, I think it would be cool to have the bands line up in retreat like drum corps international, bands of america, and even winter guard international does.

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Also, I think it would be cool to have the bands line up in retreat like drum corps international, bands of america, and even winter guard international does.

 

I'll agree to this.

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

 

It's probably a good assumption that if a number of directors wanted a format change, ISU would probably make said change if possible.

 

Oh I hope so. And I really wonder now who was at that meeting at Midwest. Additionally why would they not come to the aggreement of two different panels with completely different people for prelims and finals. They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

 

I think if you would want a better idea of illinois top 14 you would need:

  • Every band in every class competes for a finalist spot
  • Class winners aren't guaranteed a finalist spot

 

Also, I think it would be cool to have the bands line up in retreat like drum corps international, bands of america, and even winter guard international does.

 

Basically what I said, but less confusing. :-)

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It's probably a good assumption that if a number of directors wanted a format change, ISU would probably make said change if possible.

 

Oh I hope so. And I really wonder now who was at that meeting at Midwest. Additionally why would they not come to the aggreement of two different panels with completely different people for prelims and finals. They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

 

I think if you would want a better idea of illinois top 14 you would need:

  • Every band in every class competes for a finalist spot
  • Class winners aren't guaranteed a finalist spot

 

Also, I think it would be cool to have the bands line up in retreat like drum corps international, bands of america, and even winter guard international does.

 

Basically what I said, but less confusing. :-)

 

Forgot to add 2 different sets of judges for prelims and finals

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They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

 

What?

 

1) No more of this seven from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A. Make it like everywhere else that has finals or state circuits. Top 14 of the day exhibition from class champion if they don't make it. This way it makes finals actually definitively final.

 

What are the examples of "everywhere else that has finals or state circuits?"  There are class championship finals in at least seven "major marching band" states - IN, MI, WI, FL, KY, OK, SC and TX.

 

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

They still created the same problem by rotating the positions of the 5A-6A bands for finals. Mind boggling.

 

What?

Well they switch the roles of the 5A-6A panel for finals which is a still a problem.

 

1) No more of this seven from 1A-4A and 7 from 5A-6A. Make it like everywhere else that has finals or state circuits. Top 14 of the day exhibition from class champion if they don't make it. This way it makes finals actually definitively final.

 

What are the examples of "everywhere else that has finals or state circuits?"  There are class championship finals in at least seven "major marching band" states - IN, MI, WI, FL, KY, OK, SC and TX.

 

Well look at next weekend at the Joust. It has been that way for a while and it works so well. Unfortunately DGS does it the way ISU does finals, however, they don't have six classes so only three positions are locked. Then we can look at BOA events, local competitions as well as other mediums where there are finals for example the huge Speech Team circuit in Illinois. Even though that is on an individual basis they are categorized by school class just by their own event. So we don't have things like 5A Original Oratory there is just everyone lumped into one pool for whatever amount of finalist spots they have.

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By the way, before I forget, there is a new video company for ISU this year-Box 5 Media.  Also, it looks like they're planning on a webcast of prelims/finals-$12.95/per.  I've invited the owner on to discuss his company.

 

Here's a few samples of their work:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-cauEnwVa0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78fZxHU5x5Y&feature=youtu.be

 

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ISU schedule:

Class 1A

8:00 AM: Herscher

8:14 AM: Marengo

8:28 AM: University High School, Normal

8:42 AM: Olympia

8:56 AM: Illinois Valley Central

9:10 AM: Eureka

 

9:24 AM: Break

 

Class 2A

9:38 AM: Limestone Community

9:52 AM: Morton

10:06 AM: Lincoln-Way West

10:20 AM: Lakes Community

10:34 AM: Providence Catholic

 

10:48 AM: Awards

 

Class 3A

11:02 AM: Lemont

11:16 AM: Argo

11:30 AM: Normal West

11:44 AM: Bloomington

11:58 AM: Marian Catholic

 

12:12 PM: Break

 

Class 4A

12:26 PM: Open Slot

12:40 PM: Lincoln-Way North

12:54 PM: Thornton Fractional South

1:08 PM: Romeoville

1:22 PM: United Township

1:36 PM: Lincoln-Way Central

 

1:50 PM: Awards/Announcement of 1A-4A Finalists

 

Class 5A

2:18 PM: Edwardsville

2:32 PM: Wheaton North

2:46 PM: Victor J. Andrew

3:00 PM: John Hersey

3:14 PM: Lincoln-Way East

3:28 PM: Prospect

3:42 PM: Wheaton Warrenville South

 

3:56 PM: Break

 

Class 6A

4:10 PM: Lake Park

4:24 PM: Naperville Central

4:38 PM: Naperville North

4:52 PM: Warren Township

5:06 PM: Plainfield North

5:20 PM: Downers Grove South

5:34 PM: Lockport Township

 

Exhibition

5:48 PM: Big Red Marching Machine

 

6:00 PM: Awards/Announcement of 5A-6A Finalists

 

6:45 PM: Finals Begin

 

Judging Panel: No panels known at this time.

Beth Fabrizio

Joe Allison

Glen Adsit

Freddy Martin

Wayne Markworth

Ken Turner

Darrin Davis

W. Dale Warren

William Chumley

Bret Mascaro

Eric Sabach

Michael Gray

Jackie Gilley

Sal Adamo

 

 

Finalist selection: The field for finals competition will be composed of 14 bands:

- 7 finalists from 1A-4A: four 1A-4A class winners, plus the next three highest 1A-4A scores, regardless of class

- 7 finalists from 5A-6A: two 5A-6A class winners, plus the next five highest 5A-6A scores, regardless of class

Finalists from 1A-4A will be announced as part of the 3A-4A awards.

 

Finalists from 5A-6A and all performance times will be announced as part of 5A-6A awards.

 

Finals performance order: 

Finals is "bottom seven" / "top seven" where "top seven" is 3 from 1A-4A and 4 from 5A-6A

- the top three scores from 1A-4A plus the top four scores from 5A-6A will perform in positions 8-14.

- the remaining four scores from 1A-4A and three scores from 5A-6A will perform in positions 1-7.

- the 1A-4A “bottom four” bands will be random drawn for positions 1, 2, 3, 4 after 1A-4A performances.

- the 5A-6A “bottom three” bands will be random drawn for positions 5, 6, 7 after 5A-6A.

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

ISU schedule:

Class 1A

8:00 AM: Herscher

8:14 AM: Marengo

8:28 AM: University High School, Normal

8:42 AM: Olympia

8:56 AM: Illinois Valley Central

9:10 AM: Eureka

 

9:24 AM: Break

 

Class 2A

9:38 AM: Limestone Community

9:52 AM: Morton

10:06 AM: Lincoln-Way West

10:20 AM: Lakes Community

10:34 AM: Providence Catholic

 

10:48 AM: Awards

 

Class 3A

11:02 AM: Lemont

11:16 AM: Argo

11:30 AM: Normal West

11:44 AM: Bloomington

11:58 AM: Marian Catholic

 

12:12 PM: Break

 

Class 4A

12:26 PM: Open Slot

12:40 PM: Lincoln-Way North

12:54 PM: Thornton Fractional South

1:08 PM: Romeoville

1:22 PM: United Township

1:36 PM: Lincoln-Way Central

 

1:50 PM: Awards/Announcement of 1A-4A Finalists

 

Class 5A

2:18 PM: Edwardsville

2:32 PM: Wheaton North

2:46 PM: Victor J. Andrew

3:00 PM: John Hersey

3:14 PM: Lincoln-Way East

3:28 PM: Prospect

3:42 PM: Wheaton Warrenville South

 

3:56 PM: Break

 

Class 6A

4:10 PM: Lake Park

4:24 PM: Naperville Central

4:38 PM: Naperville North

4:52 PM: Warren Township

5:06 PM: Plainfield North

5:20 PM: Downers Grove South

5:34 PM: Lockport Township

 

Exhibition

5:48 PM: Big Red Marching Machine

 

6:00 PM: Awards/Announcement of 5A-6A Finalists

 

6:45 PM: Finals Begin

 

Huh????? Since when? Thought they were 5A?

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Guest Brucknerfanatic8

Huh????? Since when? Thought they were 5A?

 

I was told there might be one more band requesting a class change, and it appears Plainfield North was that band.

 

Very gutsy especially when already being bumped up a class. And who was the other band besides Plainfield North?

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Very gutsy especially when already being bumped up a class. And who was the other band besides Plainfield North?

 

More shrewd than anything, I think.

 

From what I can tell, it looks like both Marian and United Township asked to play up as well.

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